Goodin

[commish118]

Goodin is a great athlete with a below average skill set for basketball. I related in a previous post a Xavier inside said Goodin is a 9 on a scale of 1-10 as far as his athletic ability, but a 2 as far as his basketball skills.

So a kid with very very low basketball skills won Kentucky Mr. Basketball?? Hmmm ok

You better check your facts. Goodin did not win Mr. Basketball. A guy who is playing at NKU this year won Mr. Basketball in Ky. last year. That should tell you something about Goodin's talent level, NKU got a better player than we did from Ky.

I looked it up, and NKU actually ended up with two players with better talent levels than Goodin from the state of Ky. last year. They were Carson Williams, who won Mr. Basketball, and Mason Faulkner, a guard who can shoot and score. Goodin, from what I am told, impressed people with his dunks and blocks, but he was a questionable shooter in high school. The insider told me the top three players in Ky. last year were Carson Williams, Mason Faulkner, Quentin Goodin, in that order.

You better check your facts. Carson Williams is a 6'5" F. He is not a guard. You are correct about one thing, he did win Kentucky's Mr Basketball. But neither he nor Carson Williams were ranked recruits, nor were they recruited by any major programs. That is why they ended up at NKU. Q, on the other hand, was a 4 Star recruit, ranked the # 20 PG in the country, #5 PG in the mid-west, and #1 PG in Kentucky, and the #68 college recruit overall from the class of 2016. He choose Xavier over Florida, Miami (FL), and Michigan, (his final choices).

Of course, you probably know more than college coaches and recruiters. So maybe you are right. Q has no talent. Maybe you should just follow NKY instead of XU. They recruit better players. They probably have a better coach too. And if you start following them, they will have more knowledgeable fans.

[XU Captain]

You better check your facts. Carson Williams is a 6'5" F. He is not a guard. You are correct about one thing, he did win Kentucky's Mr Basketball. But neither he nor Carson Williams were ranked recruits, nor were they recruited by any major programs. That is why they ended up at NKU. Q, on the other hand, was a 4 Star recruit, ranked the # 20 PG in the country, #5 PG in the mid-west, and #1 PG in Kentucky, and the #68 college recruit overall from the class of 2016. He choose Xavier over Florida, Miami (FL), and Michigan, (his final choices).

Of course, you probably know more than college coaches and recruiters. So maybe you are right. Q has no talent. Maybe you should just follow NKY instead of XU. They recruit better players. They probably have a better coach too. And if you start following them, they will have more knowledgeable fans.[/quote]

You need to take a chill pill. I was correct in saying Goodin was not Mr. Basketball in Ky. The coaches in that state felt Williams was better than Goodin. I looked at Williams stats at NKU and he is averaging double figures, was named their conference Freshman of the Week like three times already. Goodin, according to a recruiting guru in Indiana, was one of the most over-hyped HS players in history because he could dunk. He could never shoot, either from the field or FT line. That has continued in college. Now he has great athletic ability. But one of the Xavier assistants has told me as recently as last week they are afraid Goodin is nothing more than a 8th or 9th man with a full roster. He was not supposed to play this much. As for your post about #68 college recruit, I guess the HS coaches in Ky. knew better since they gave the Mr. Basketball to a NKU recruit who is now putting up way better numbers than Goodin. It's called a recruiting mistake by the coaches. Goodin is not going to suddenly be a better FT shooter or make layups. He is a dunker and athlete.

[PT71]

Watched a coaches roundtable discussion on TV last night, hosted by Steve Lavin, with guest coaches, Gene Keady, Tim Miles, Bo Ryan and Mike Davis. Very insightful and entertaining. Each put forth their "coaching tree," and how they got where they are or were, in Keady and Ryan's cases, as they are retired. Miles currently is coach at Nebraska and Davis at Texas Southern. Keady made the point that as a coach you CAN teach a player how to shoot...all things being equal, he said that is the one area within a player's skill set that can be improved. I suggest that they know what they are talking about! Do ya think the X staff works with Goodin on shooting?

[longliveskip]

Agree Joe plus we haven't really beat anyone really good with Trevon. Having your coach with his head in his hands the last two games doesn't help.

i love how it always points back to Mack being clueless and having no idea what to do with this group. are you serious? they have basically lost their top 3 scorers from last season, and you think you can just wave a magic coaching wand and everyone can start doing things that they don't normally do??? what planet do you live on, Hops? whatever you're smoking and drinking, i would love some because your insight into this is completely ridiculous.

we all thought we were done when we lost Sumner and we won two in a row, but then we lose our next best player/scorer - tell me how many other teams bounce back from that? tell me how many games Nova wins if they lost Brunson for the season, then Hart for another 2-3 games? you act like all these other teams have been without their top 3 scorers and they just keep plugging away, winning games, because their coaches are better. that's simply not true.

get over yourself for one second. you can sit on your couch, eat your chips, drink your beer, and give all the MMQB commentary you want about how Mack is lost, doesn't know what he's doing, can't coach these guys, etc, but you couldn't be further from the truth. even if we had Coach K, we aren't beating the top half of the Big East with the players we've lost.

[commish118]

You need to take a chill pill.

I need to take a chill pill? I am not the one criticizing a freshman player on a public forum, along with Chris Mack and the job his coaches do recruiting, just because the team is down it's top players and lost a few games.

[X-lucidity]

Spot on Commish! This forum certainly invites opinions of all sorts. I would have never thought we had so many who were easily rattled and ready to throw the baby out with the bath water due to this recent spate of injuries / defection which has resulted in a few losses to solid programs. Take a step back folks. We all come on here with our silly pseudonyms, (I mean look I mine!), and we have fun bantering about this sport we love so much. Lately, it has seemed to turn a bit jaded, a bit bitter. Are Mack & his staff tops on the planet? Nope. Is he pretty darn good? Yup. Are Mack & staff pretty solid at recruiting? Yup... Do we have a consistent top 25 program that is respected and envied by hundreds of others? Yup. Adversity separates the men from the boys. Struggles like these past few weeks is what makes the successful runs that much more enjoyable.
Debating these subjects is an enjoyable hobby for all of us. I am very appreciative and supportive of this current coaching staff and roster of players. Goodin & Jones are true Frosh that are holding their own and growing with each extra minute on the court.
Love me some college b-ball.

[XU Captain]

You need to take a chill pill.

I need to take a chill pill? I am not the one criticizing a freshman player on a public forum, along with Chris Mack and the job his coaches do recruiting, just because the team is down it's top players and lost a few games.

It is funny how being a freshman does not stop the guy at UCLA or the guy at Washington from excelling this season. My point was Goodin was not regarded as a top-flight player in his own state. The HS coaches in Ky. selected a player who is at NKU as better than Goodin, and it appears they were correct. That is not criticizing Goodin at all, just a fact that shows the recruiting experts miss on players and judge their talents as too high. Goodin is a great athlete, a below-average basketball player because of his limitations in shooting and ball handling. He is too small to be a forward, not a skilled shooter to be a two-guard, and his lack of offense makes it tough to have him on the floor for key minutes in a game. Maybe he will develop into a defensive stopper and devote enough time to improve his shooting. Or maybe he will be the next over-hyped recruit that so many of these so-called recruiting experts miss on. No one really wanted Brian Grant, he wasn't highly recruited, and look what happened. Just because you are a 4-star recruit does not guarantee anything. Likewise, not being regarded as much of a recruit does not mean a player won't have the last laugh and play 10 years in the NBA.

[commish118]

It's not the message/subject, it is the timing. This is a great subject after his Junior season, when you can actually look at all these kids and assess who was a "miss" and who wasn't. Kids are recruited for their potential At least wait until the season is over. What good does this discussion do right now? None!

[commish118]

And, by the way, I am happy to discuss/argue your statements/beliefs... after the season.

[oldhoopster2]

Q has the best assist to turnover ratio on the team, even better than Ed's. When he is driving and dishing, he creates a lot of scoring. I agree he's a horrible finisher at this point cause in college he won't get all the dunks he did in HS. However, with Tre he has more passing options and is not needed to shoot as much. Throw in Ed and Q really can get by with an occasional shot or drive to keep the defense honest, but be a point guard who distributes the ball to the scorers. I remember someone saying that Tu shot thousands of shots over the summer. Maybe that's what Q needs to do, shoot all summer. We'll see how he progresses, but I think he can be good. As for comparisons to the guy from NKU, how many points per game would he average in the Big East against our competition? Who knows, but its not really an apples to apples comparison in my mind.