We Are Marshall

[Wisexuowl]

Memories ... memories ...

MOR has some, correct and not so correct.

And as for the "critics" saying the movie stuck to the facts ... give me a break.

Setting aside the fact we had an "older" coach and a black coach, and the cemetery pre-game talk by the Marshall Coach describing Xavier, a team with a great all-American running back " and that the Xavier team was a "powerful, big fast," the critics might be right.

In any case, the game was surreal.

Just to set the stage. The previous November on a miserable cold and rainy night, I got a call at home from the Cincinnati AP office telling me of the crash, that there were no survivors, and wanting to know if I knew about any possible former Cincinnati high school players on the team. I told them that perhaps a dozen, perhaps more, as Marshall always had a bunch of Cincinnati kids. I tell you this because it (their deaths) became a part of the story.

When we took the field to warm up, and to start the game, the stadium was packed ... and the stadium was "SILENT."

The people in the stands, the players on both sides, the media .. just everyone ... culdcare less. Everyone's minds were on all those people who were supposed to be on the field, but weren't ... and that is how the game went .. polite applause but not a football crowd.

They are known as the "Thundering Herd" and they had a live mascot ... a buffalo. When both teams came back on the field for the second half (Xavier had control of things) that damn buffalo broke loose and every sane person got off the field. Campus security tried corralling the buffalo (a joke), then the local PD in the area, and finally, a call went out to animal protective services and a couple of vets.

It was a good solid half hour after the halftime intermission, did they finally get things back under control, and the game resumed.

Now, we get down to less than a minute to play, we have the ball, deep in our own territory, and on fourth down we punted from out of the end zone and they took over like on their own 49 ... not their own 20 ... not eighty yards away. And MOR , there was no “west coast offense” .. and there was no “spread” offense.

They got 20-25 yards on 2 or three plays and on the last play of the game (and this is how I remembered it) their qb, a scat back type, took the snap (no shotgun those days either) and started looking for a receiver ... running all over the place dodging our guys, and in desperation after time expired, completed a pass for a TD .. and the game. 15,000 people just sat there, stunned ... like this was all a dream.

Did Marshall win the game? Did Xavier lose the game? For me ... neither...

To me those players who had been killed won the game. They were there just as sure as I could be. The whole day was as eerie as it could be.


And those kids from Cincinnati? They were a part of it. Our "locals" knew 'em .. worked out in the summer with 'em, knew their Moms and Dads. Our kids really, really didn't want to play the game ... and our coaches who recruited against their coaches that were killed, went to clinics with them, etc, didn't want to play the game either ... tough circumstances for the Xavier players and coaches .. and the Xavier staff , my fellow SID was killed, their media was killed, Jim's fellow AD was killed, Baldy's fellow trainer was killed ... it goes on and on.

But, I am glad the story was told, because it tells a lot about college athletics. That tragedy brought that whole town together and whereas before Marshall wasn't a part of the "city" so to speak, they are now.

Now, one thing I shall not let pass is critics of Selcer. The downfall of Xavier football came "before" Selcer. Two months after taking over a program, and after bringing in a pair of super coaches in Tom Cecchini, and Jim Colletto, the University told Selcer that they were cutting the scholarship program from 18 per year to 12 ... and oh, by the way because of a snafu in the Admissions office, every returning player .... EVERY ONE OF THEM ... had a FULL room, board, books, and fees scholarship, therefore "in your first season Dick, you have NO ... NONE ... NADA grants to give ... but lots of luck playing UC, Miami, Villanova, Bowling Green, Toledo, Kent State et al short-handed.....

No MOR, Dick was a fine football coach ... good enough to coach at Wisconsin, Houston Oilers, Cincinnati, Detroit Lions, and the Bengals ...Tom Cecchini will be the first to tell you that he was able to go 5-5 because in Dick's two seasons he got enough quality players via the Ohio Educational Bond system.

Colleto was a helluva coach too ... ND, Ohio State, Purdue, Baltimore Ravens, UCLA etc etc etc.

Well, that’s all folks .. but I would much be remembered as the team that lost to Marshall, than Miami who the next week beat them …. 66-6!

[Masterofreality]

Well, Wise. I could only tell about "Alka" from my student observations. My memories about the radio broadcast of the game is pretty accurate.

Would you, then, put the blame for the bad football on Irv Etler, or who? If Tom Checchini could go 5-5-1 two years later with Dick's players, how could Dick not do OK with the remnants of Ed Biles' last recruiting class?

The one thing we all agree on is that The Great Philosopher Mulligan chunked a spear into the athletic program that the illustrious Paul L. O'Connor dearly loved and wanted to be successful. I know for a fact that Father O'Connor hated it when his alma mater Loyola Chicago dropped football. I know it killed him when Xavier did.

Mulligan never understood that a school can build an identity through its athletic programs like the administration today and Fr. Hoff knew. Thank Gawd for Bill Daley to and Big Jim to keep some semblance of sanity.

[Lead Guitar]

And Evansville had ties to XU as well!

[basket]

Wise, that was a GREAT story you just told! Last year I had a couple of kids enter a project into a District level contest for National History Day, here in SE.MO. Their project was over the tragedy that took place to Marshall. I was just 5 when this happened but it made me proud as a S.S teacher to see these kids make a project out of it! I can ONLY imagine what it was actually like that day in Huntington. Thanks again for the story and for TEACHING me something about Marshall!!!

Memories ... memories ...

MOR has some, correct and not so correct.

And as for the "critics" saying the movie stuck to the facts ... give me a break.

Setting aside the fact we had an "older" coach and a black coach, and the cemetery pre-game talk by the Marshall Coach describing Xavier, a team with a great all-American running back " and that the Xavier team was a "powerful, big fast," the critics might be right.

In any case, the game was surreal.

Just to set the stage. The previous November on a miserable cold and rainy night, I got a call at home from the Cincinnati AP office telling me of the crash, that there were no survivors, and wanting to know if I knew about any possible former Cincinnati high school players on the team. I told them that perhaps a dozen, perhaps more, as Marshall always had a bunch of Cincinnati kids. I tell you this because it (their deaths) became a part of the story.

When we took the field to warm up, and to start the game, the stadium was packed ... and the stadium was "SILENT."

The people in the stands, the players on both sides, the media .. just everyone ... culdcare less. Everyone's minds were on all those people who were supposed to be on the field, but weren't ... and that is how the game went .. polite applause but not a football crowd.

They are known as the "Thundering Herd" and they had a live mascot ... a buffalo. When both teams came back on the field for the second half (Xavier had control of things) that damn buffalo broke loose and every sane person got off the field. Campus security tried corralling the buffalo (a joke), then the local PD in the area, and finally, a call went out to animal protective services and a couple of vets.

It was a good solid half hour after the halftime intermission, did they finally get things back under control, and the game resumed.

Now, we get down to less than a minute to play, we have the ball, deep in our own territory, and on fourth down we punted from out of the end zone and they took over like on their own 49 ... not their own 20 ... not eighty yards away. And MOR , there was no “west coast offense” .. and there was no “spread” offense.

They got 20-25 yards on 2 or three plays and on the last play of the game (and this is how I remembered it) their qb, a scat back type, took the snap (no shotgun those days either) and started looking for a receiver ... running all over the place dodging our guys, and in desperation after time expired, completed a pass for a TD .. and the game. 15,000 people just sat there, stunned ... like this was all a dream.

Did Marshall win the game? Did Xavier lose the game? For me ... neither...

To me those players who had been killed won the game. They were there just as sure as I could be. The whole day was as eerie as it could be.


And those kids from Cincinnati? They were a part of it. Our "locals" knew 'em .. worked out in the summer with 'em, knew their Moms and Dads. Our kids really, really didn't want to play the game ... and our coaches who recruited against their coaches that were killed, went to clinics with them, etc, didn't want to play the game either ... tough circumstances for the Xavier players and coaches .. and the Xavier staff , my fellow SID was killed, their media was killed, Jim's fellow AD was killed, Baldy's fellow trainer was killed ... it goes on and on.

But, I am glad the story was told, because it tells a lot about college athletics. That tragedy brought that whole town together and whereas before Marshall wasn't a part of the "city" so to speak, they are now.

Now, one thing I shall not let pass is critics of Selcer. The downfall of Xavier football came "before" Selcer. Two months after taking over a program, and after bringing in a pair of super coaches in Tom Cecchini, and Jim Colletto, the University told Selcer that they were cutting the scholarship program from 18 per year to 12 ... and oh, by the way because of a snafu in the Admissions office, every returning player .... EVERY ONE OF THEM ... had a FULL room, board, books, and fees scholarship, therefore "in your first season Dick, you have NO ... NONE ... NADA grants to give ... but lots of luck playing UC, Miami, Villanova, Bowling Green, Toledo, Kent State et al short-handed.....

No MOR, Dick was a fine football coach ... good enough to coach at Wisconsin, Houston Oilers, Cincinnati, Detroit Lions, and the Bengals ...Tom Cecchini will be the first to tell you that he was able to go 5-5 because in Dick's two seasons he got enough quality players via the Ohio Educational Bond system.

Colleto was a helluva coach too ... ND, Ohio State, Purdue, Baltimore Ravens, UCLA etc etc etc.

Well, that’s all folks .. but I would much be remembered as the team that lost to Marshall, than Miami who the next week beat them …. 66-6!

[vee4xu]

Thanks wise, MOR and Mr. N for weighing in with a spectacular summary of the game's events. When I read wise's summary I felt as if I was at the game. I wondered if X was any good that year, obviously they were not. Was Tim Dydo the QB in that game for X?

Also for those of you who mentioned Evansville's basketball team, do not forget that one of the Wichita State football team's planes crashed about one year either side of the Marshall crash.

Thanks all.

[xubrew]

after hearing the accounts on this thread, i don't think the movie did an accurate enough job of portraying just how badly xavier must have sucked.

i'm not a huge fan of most disney films, but i did enjoy miracle, invincible, the rookie and glory road. i'd rank we are marshall below those four. it has nothing to do with xavier losing. it's just that i didn't think it was quite as good as those others.

[xubrew]

not used to having more than one page per thread yet. this was a great story to read. i actually enjoyed this much more than the movie.

Memories ... memories ...

MOR has some, correct and not so correct.

And as for the "critics" saying the movie stuck to the facts ... give me a break.

Setting aside the fact we had an "older" coach and a black coach, and the cemetery pre-game talk by the Marshall Coach describing Xavier, a team with a great all-American running back " and that the Xavier team was a "powerful, big fast," the critics might be right.

In any case, the game was surreal.

Just to set the stage. The previous November on a miserable cold and rainy night, I got a call at home from the Cincinnati AP office telling me of the crash, that there were no survivors, and wanting to know if I knew about any possible former Cincinnati high school players on the team. I told them that perhaps a dozen, perhaps more, as Marshall always had a bunch of Cincinnati kids. I tell you this because it (their deaths) became a part of the story.

When we took the field to warm up, and to start the game, the stadium was packed ... and the stadium was "SILENT."

The people in the stands, the players on both sides, the media .. just everyone ... culdcare less. Everyone's minds were on all those people who were supposed to be on the field, but weren't ... and that is how the game went .. polite applause but not a football crowd.

They are known as the "Thundering Herd" and they had a live mascot ... a buffalo. When both teams came back on the field for the second half (Xavier had control of things) that damn buffalo broke loose and every sane person got off the field. Campus security tried corralling the buffalo (a joke), then the local PD in the area, and finally, a call went out to animal protective services and a couple of vets.

It was a good solid half hour after the halftime intermission, did they finally get things back under control, and the game resumed.

Now, we get down to less than a minute to play, we have the ball, deep in our own territory, and on fourth down we punted from out of the end zone and they took over like on their own 49 ... not their own 20 ... not eighty yards away. And MOR , there was no “west coast offense” .. and there was no “spread” offense.

They got 20-25 yards on 2 or three plays and on the last play of the game (and this is how I remembered it) their qb, a scat back type, took the snap (no shotgun those days either) and started looking for a receiver ... running all over the place dodging our guys, and in desperation after time expired, completed a pass for a TD .. and the game. 15,000 people just sat there, stunned ... like this was all a dream.

Did Marshall win the game? Did Xavier lose the game? For me ... neither...

To me those players who had been killed won the game. They were there just as sure as I could be. The whole day was as eerie as it could be.


And those kids from Cincinnati? They were a part of it. Our "locals" knew 'em .. worked out in the summer with 'em, knew their Moms and Dads. Our kids really, really didn't want to play the game ... and our coaches who recruited against their coaches that were killed, went to clinics with them, etc, didn't want to play the game either ... tough circumstances for the Xavier players and coaches .. and the Xavier staff , my fellow SID was killed, their media was killed, Jim's fellow AD was killed, Baldy's fellow trainer was killed ... it goes on and on.

But, I am glad the story was told, because it tells a lot about college athletics. That tragedy brought that whole town together and whereas before Marshall wasn't a part of the "city" so to speak, they are now.

Now, one thing I shall not let pass is critics of Selcer. The downfall of Xavier football came "before" Selcer. Two months after taking over a program, and after bringing in a pair of super coaches in Tom Cecchini, and Jim Colletto, the University told Selcer that they were cutting the scholarship program from 18 per year to 12 ... and oh, by the way because of a snafu in the Admissions office, every returning player .... EVERY ONE OF THEM ... had a FULL room, board, books, and fees scholarship, therefore "in your first season Dick, you have NO ... NONE ... NADA grants to give ... but lots of luck playing UC, Miami, Villanova, Bowling Green, Toledo, Kent State et al short-handed.....

No MOR, Dick was a fine football coach ... good enough to coach at Wisconsin, Houston Oilers, Cincinnati, Detroit Lions, and the Bengals ...Tom Cecchini will be the first to tell you that he was able to go 5-5 because in Dick's two seasons he got enough quality players via the Ohio Educational Bond system.

Colleto was a helluva coach too ... ND, Ohio State, Purdue, Baltimore Ravens, UCLA etc etc etc.

Well, that’s all folks .. but I would much be remembered as the team that lost to Marshall, than Miami who the next week beat them …. 66-6!

[sash19]

I was born and raised in Huntington on Marshall football and basketball. My father played for Marshall in the '60's and knew many of the players as they were being recruited while he was still there playing. The head coach was also his freshman coach. This happened before I was born but I can tell you, this city and school will never be "over" the tragedy that happened that night. I went to school with people who lost grandparents or aunts and uncles that night. I was friends with people who lost parents that night. I also went to grade school with Red Dawson's son. To this day (saw him when Marshall came to play UC this season), Red is still destroyed inside over this event. The people from Huntington are so attached to Marshall football that you would not believe it. The younger generation does not understand this loyalty but no one could honestly expect them too. However, the people who were there, who lived to see so many funerals that the city basically shut down will never stop supporting Marshall and especially their football team. I know that no matter where I live in the country, I will always love, support and cheer for the Thundering Herd.

This movie, while taking some cinema liberties, did portray the horror, sorrow and loss that everyone faced. The game scenes were not 100% correct as Wise noted, however the point of the movie, the loss of so many loved ones, was spot on. From the crash site, which I have seen in person to the Memorial Fountain on campus (built with a spire for each person who died that night) that a ceremony is held on the anniversary each year to shut down the water supply as a sign of loss to the marker for the deceased that were not able to be identified, it is all true and 100% accurate. The marker at the cemetary is high up on a hill that can see straight into the stadium with nothing blocking it to the memorial statue outside the stadium, it will never be forgotten.

While I had trouble watching the movie, I feel that is was long overdue. To show the huge loss turn into the spirited return to glory, it is an honor to say that I am from Huntington and have an attachment to that team and program (due to my dad and upbringing) that will always be cherished. The players at Marshall know they are playing for more than themselves. They take pride in knowing that they are also playing for those lost that night.

[Frambo]

Well, that’s all folks .. but I would much be remembered as the team that lost to Marshall, than Miami who the next week beat them …. 66-6!

Wise - I KNOW that Miami is not very proud of that victory. 2 of my friends were on that Redskin team....one a backup safety and one a freshman, who of course wouldn't play back in those days, but would be a big part of their later Tangerine bowl teams. As we have our drinks, many times that game comes up and those two reminisce. Miami played well and the backup, who usually hardly ever played, was in the game in the first half.

[surfxu]

Thanks for all your memories...this thread is a very cool read.