Mack to...

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Anti-Homer
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Re: Mack to...

Postby Anti-Homer » Sat Jan 13, 2018 6:04 pm

tacitus wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:28 pm
There are some people who would obviously be happy with Mack leaving. But it would be devastating to Xavier and the Big East.

If a perenial top-25 team in a prenial top-3 league cannot keep an up-and-coming coach, then it would send the wrong signal to recruits, other up-and-coming coaches, the media, and general hoops fan base.

Mack has not perfected his coaching style just yet. I really think he can take us to our first Final Four, or beyond. I just don't see any coach in the country replacing him withoug a major loss in momentum. Being in an a very unforgiving league, it could take us 5-10 years to get back to the Sweet 16.

Xavier and the Big East need Mack to stay until he has passed his prime and we have a Final Four under our belt to advertise ourselves as a destination job.

Wow!

Same things were said when Gillen, Prosser, Matta, & Miller left. The culture of winning at X absolutely dwarfs CM, as it did with his predecessors. Also, losing the three best players, and another key contributor in O'Mara, coupled with an inferior recruiting class would provide the perfect time to leave. He has been gone twice in the past but reneged on Tenn when he learned of the sanctions, and CA when his wife vetoed it.

Louisville is arguably a top 7 job, who can triple CM's salary. Also, Louisville is just as much a hometown to CM as Cincinnati is. The only concern I have is that Bobinski is not the AD. With all due respect to Christopher, he hit the lotto a few years ago when he was plucked from BG. Frankly, I saw no great accomplishment during his tenure, but obviously, I hope he will be up to the task if it comes to it. Hopefully, he won't need to make that decision.
tacitus
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Re: Mack to...

Postby tacitus » Sun Jan 14, 2018 9:28 am

Anti-Homer wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 6:04 pm
tacitus wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:28 pm
There are some people who would obviously be happy with Mack leaving. But it would be devastating to Xavier and the Big East.

If a perenial top-25 team in a prenial top-3 league cannot keep an up-and-coming coach, then it would send the wrong signal to recruits, other up-and-coming coaches, the media, and general hoops fan base.

Mack has not perfected his coaching style just yet. I really think he can take us to our first Final Four, or beyond. I just don't see any coach in the country replacing him withoug a major loss in momentum. Being in an a very unforgiving league, it could take us 5-10 years to get back to the Sweet 16.

Xavier and the Big East need Mack to stay until he has passed his prime and we have a Final Four under our belt to advertise ourselves as a destination job.

Wow!

Same things were said when Gillen, Prosser, Matta, & Miller left. The culture of winning at X absolutely dwarfs CM, as it did with his predecessors. Also, losing the three best players, and another key contributor in O'Mara, coupled with an inferior recruiting class would provide the perfect time to leave. He has been gone twice in the past but reneged on Tenn when he learned of the sanctions, and CA when his wife vetoed it.

Louisville is arguably a top 7 job, who can triple CM's salary. Also, Louisville is just as much a hometown to CM as Cincinnati is. The only concern I have is that Bobinski is not the AD. With all due respect to Christopher, he hit the lotto a few years ago when he was plucked from BG. Frankly, I saw no great accomplishment during his tenure, but obviously, I hope he will be up to the task if it comes to it. Hopefully, he won't need to make that decision.
The Big East is competing with the power 5 schools for media time and recruits. Right now, we have four very solid D-1 basketball coaches and two NBA hall of famers who may turn out to be solid coaches. Fox Sports has been (perhaps strategically) selling the narrative all season about how Mack is the hometwon hero who has turned X into a destination job, the way the likes of Wright and Few have at their schools. Along comes Louisville and plucks him away without a fight to speak of. Apparently just whispers of that possibility has hurt recruiting and put Fox Sports on the defensive. If he leaves, it will be a major set back. Would we hire an up-and-coming coach to replace him? Of course! Would we continue to compete in the Big East and make runs in the tourney? Of course? But Mack is the only shot I can see for X becoming a destination job, for X making it to the Final Four in the next few years, and for the Big East solidifying its deserved role as a power conference with more than one elite team. (Even ESPN has come around!) That is what we are on the verge of right now. If Mack leaves, it puts all that off for who knows how long unless we really hit the lottery with the next hire.
Let's March!
kyzrex
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Re: Mack to...

Postby kyzrex » Sun Jan 14, 2018 9:55 am

It wasn’t that long ago that louseyvillesucks was on a par with UC. They were in the same conference through many different versions and where similar in size and budget. Addias money changed all that and it became a “destination” job. The money from Yum brands, specifically Papa John’s and KFC, also helped to build the stadium and arena. But the city is now on the hook for a large part of the Yum Center costs and many people down there are questioning if it was a good thing afterall. Will be interesting to see if the Addias money and the Yum money start to dry up over the next few years. It’s certainly a possibility. X will NEVER be in a position to pay the money out that louseyvillesucks can right now. If Mack wants to chase the money he will look beyond X. He has kids that with the kind of money he could get offered to take that job could be set up for life. That’s certainly going to be a consideration. But there are a lot of other things that come with that job besides the money. There are a lot of pressures and expectations that he doesn’t face now. There is a certain loss of privacy and a certain amount of celebrity that come with that job. Mack can hang out with his buddies at a local watering hole now, and people just leave him alone for the most part. I don’t see that happening for a coach down there. If you guys think the posters on the X boards can be hard and cruel at times, you don’t have any idea what it’s like for coaches down there. Sports radio here barely even mentions X, down there UL is 24/7/52, expect when a UK happens to call in wanting to stir the pot. I hope he stays.
#WHYNOTX?
bleedXblue
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Re: Mack to...

Postby bleedXblue » Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:04 am

tacitus wrote:
Sun Jan 14, 2018 9:28 am
Anti-Homer wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 6:04 pm
tacitus wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:28 pm
There are some people who would obviously be happy with Mack leaving. But it would be devastating to Xavier and the Big East.

If a perenial top-25 team in a prenial top-3 league cannot keep an up-and-coming coach, then it would send the wrong signal to recruits, other up-and-coming coaches, the media, and general hoops fan base.

Mack has not perfected his coaching style just yet. I really think he can take us to our first Final Four, or beyond. I just don't see any coach in the country replacing him withoug a major loss in momentum. Being in an a very unforgiving league, it could take us 5-10 years to get back to the Sweet 16.

Xavier and the Big East need Mack to stay until he has passed his prime and we have a Final Four under our belt to advertise ourselves as a destination job.

Wow!

Same things were said when Gillen, Prosser, Matta, & Miller left. The culture of winning at X absolutely dwarfs CM, as it did with his predecessors. Also, losing the three best players, and another key contributor in O'Mara, coupled with an inferior recruiting class would provide the perfect time to leave. He has been gone twice in the past but reneged on Tenn when he learned of the sanctions, and CA when his wife vetoed it.

Louisville is arguably a top 7 job, who can triple CM's salary. Also, Louisville is just as much a hometown to CM as Cincinnati is. The only concern I have is that Bobinski is not the AD. With all due respect to Christopher, he hit the lotto a few years ago when he was plucked from BG. Frankly, I saw no great accomplishment during his tenure, but obviously, I hope he will be up to the task if it comes to it. Hopefully, he won't need to make that decision.
The Big East is competing with the power 5 schools for media time and recruits. Right now, we have four very solid D-1 basketball coaches and two NBA hall of famers who may turn out to be solid coaches. Fox Sports has been (perhaps strategically) selling the narrative all season about how Mack is the hometwon hero who has turned X into a destination job, the way the likes of Wright and Few have at their schools. Along comes Louisville and plucks him away without a fight to speak of. Apparently just whispers of that possibility has hurt recruiting and put Fox Sports on the defensive. If he leaves, it will be a major set back. Would we hire an up-and-coming coach to replace him? Of course! Would we continue to compete in the Big East and make runs in the tourney? Of course? But Mack is the only shot I can see for X becoming a destination job, for X making it to the Final Four in the next few years, and for the Big East solidifying its deserved role as a power conference with more than one elite team. (Even ESPN has come around!) That is what we are on the verge of right now. If Mack leaves, it puts all that off for who knows how long unless we really hit the lottery with the next hire.
Thats why you pay the man....he should be making over 2 mil per year.....hands down, no question about it. Period.
Anti-Homer
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Re: Mack to...

Postby Anti-Homer » Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:29 am

tacitus wrote:
Sun Jan 14, 2018 9:28 am
Anti-Homer wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 6:04 pm
tacitus wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:28 pm
There are some people who would obviously be happy with Mack leaving. But it would be devastating to Xavier and the Big East.

If a perenial top-25 team in a prenial top-3 league cannot keep an up-and-coming coach, then it would send the wrong signal to recruits, other up-and-coming coaches, the media, and general hoops fan base.

Mack has not perfected his coaching style just yet. I really think he can take us to our first Final Four, or beyond. I just don't see any coach in the country replacing him withoug a major loss in momentum. Being in an a very unforgiving league, it could take us 5-10 years to get back to the Sweet 16.

Xavier and the Big East need Mack to stay until he has passed his prime and we have a Final Four under our belt to advertise ourselves as a destination job.

Wow!

Same things were said when Gillen, Prosser, Matta, & Miller left. The culture of winning at X absolutely dwarfs CM, as it did with his predecessors. Also, losing the three best players, and another key contributor in O'Mara, coupled with an inferior recruiting class would provide the perfect time to leave. He has been gone twice in the past but reneged on Tenn when he learned of the sanctions, and CA when his wife vetoed it.

Louisville is arguably a top 7 job, who can triple CM's salary. Also, Louisville is just as much a hometown to CM as Cincinnati is. The only concern I have is that Bobinski is not the AD. With all due respect to Christopher, he hit the lotto a few years ago when he was plucked from BG. Frankly, I saw no great accomplishment during his tenure, but obviously, I hope he will be up to the task if it comes to it. Hopefully, he won't need to make that decision.
The Big East is competing with the power 5 schools for media time and recruits. Right now, we have four very solid D-1 basketball coaches and two NBA hall of famers who may turn out to be solid coaches. Fox Sports has been (perhaps strategically) selling the narrative all season about how Mack is the hometwon hero who has turned X into a destination job, the way the likes of Wright and Few have at their schools. Along comes Louisville and plucks him away without a fight to speak of. Apparently just whispers of that possibility has hurt recruiting and put Fox Sports on the defensive. If he leaves, it will be a major set back. Would we hire an up-and-coming coach to replace him? Of course! Would we continue to compete in the Big East and make runs in the tourney? Of course? But Mack is the only shot I can see for X becoming a destination job, for X making it to the Final Four in the next few years, and for the Big East solidifying its deserved role as a power conference with more than one elite team. (Even ESPN has come around!) That is what we are on the verge of right now. If Mack leaves, it puts all that off for who knows how long unless we really hit the lottery with the next hire.
Tacitus,

I don't think the comment re: recruiting is accurate. I think most of the misses occurred before the scandal hit, and with the late misses, X didn't seem to be one of the last two teams in the mix. Also, CM's wife is from the Ville, so that, the huge raise, and going to a national power says more about the elite job of being the Ville's HC is, rather than any deficit at X.

X can up the ante but doesn't have the endowment to compete. However, it's time for Christopher to show his value by fundraising with big pocket corporate and individual (Muskieman) donors to give him a bump in pay if he isn't paid like a top 25 coach currently. It has to needle him that the underachieving coach across town reportedly makes several hundred thousand more than he does annually. Why else did he accept the CA job, before his wife vetoed it, if not for money? CA is not an attractive job.

Hopefully, the systemic corrupt culture and lack of institutional control will compel the NCAA to put the hammer down hard. Ironically, the Ville will have to help the NCAA do their job by providing evidence to the former, as they defend themselves from Pitino and Jurich's lawsuits. I'm sure they'll settle, to minimize public disclosure among other reasons.

I hope he stays, but if not, this is probably the optimal time for X. They lose their top 3 players and very valuable sub in O-Mara, and also have a subpar recruiting class, which comes off of the heels of losing a lot of players who transferred. That could set X back a couple of years. I don't think that's lost on any high-level coach.
Xavier2005
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Re: Mack to...

Postby Xavier2005 » Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:49 pm

I would hope Chris Mack stays and makes Xavier the next Duke or North Carolina of men's basketball....with regard to wins and National Titles. However, he would need more better recruits and or 5 star players. The one thing that may hold Xavier back is $$$$$. Chris Mack at some point will be able to double his salary elsewhere and play in a bigger top 5 Conference. However, in another Big Conference .... football will be the king in another conference...and CM will be a small fish in a big ocean and if he does not succeed...then fired for another coach. Xavier will not be able to pay CM $5 to $10 million a year...Louisville and others can pay that.
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Re: Mack to...

Postby DannyV76 » Sun Jan 14, 2018 1:13 pm

I Love that Gus & Bill are the #1 team for the Big East on Fox Sports1. Having said that, why would Gus open with the "Coach Mack to UL" comment right at tip off, with the best two teams in the Big East playing each other? I think commentary about the GAME on the court would have been more appropriate than talking about a situation that won't have an outcome until March/April.
This seems to be a trend lately with Adam Shefter "reporting" Marvin Lewis will not be back as coach with three games to go. ESPN the Magazine story on the whole Patriot Brady/Garrapolo/Kraft deal.
Whether CM stays or eventually does go to Louisville will be a huge national story.
At least Bill had the right answer with "Don't mess with Happy".
Is it too much to ask that we can enjoy the games and the season until the "talks" heat up? Just asking.
Xavier2005
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Re: Mack to...

Postby Xavier2005 » Sun Jan 14, 2018 1:35 pm

the answer??? for some it is "to report the news and facts" and for many others " it is to create the news or stir the pot....not to report facts" in all arenas of life.
Theology73
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Re: Mack to...

Postby Theology73 » Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:26 pm

Contrary to what most people think, not everyone is motivated solely by money. Some people who are already making a ton of money are motivated by other factors and don't necessarily feel the need to double or triple the already large sum they make. For some people, the happiness of their family is far more important. Kristi's family is from Louisville, but Chris' is in Cincinnati. His daughters are thriving and happy at their school. Chris also has very strong ties to his Xavier family. Sure, Big East schools cannot pay what big five league schools can, but the Big East is an annual National Champion potential league. Perhaps Chris may just be motivated by becoming the Coach K of Xavier. Perhaps he enjoys being the most respected member of his home town's sports community. Perhaps the relationships he has developed his entire life in Cincinnati are a larger factor in his decision-making process than the pot of gold at the end of a rainbow that does not contain any of the other things that make him fulfilled and happy. I hope he stays at X until he retires. His character and background give me hope that this is possible, maybe even probable.
Mark Twain was wrong. Golf is NOT a good walk spoiled. It is a shared personal experience in a majestic wonderland guided by God, whose name is called frequently during the round.
sweet67
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Re: Mack to...

Postby sweet67 » Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:11 pm

Theology73 wrote:
Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:26 pm
Perhaps he enjoys being the most respected member of his home town's sports community. Perhaps the relationships he has developed his entire life in Cincinnati are a larger factor in his decision-making process than the pot of gold at the end of a rainbow that does not contain any of the other things that make him fulfilled and happy. I hope he stays at X until he retires. His character and background give me hope that this is possible, maybe even probable.
1st sentence I quoted is a stretch.

Mack lost some respect and character points both within X and outside when he decided to bring Eddie Ekiyor to campus. That was absolutely ridiculous.

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